| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Unpaid hours of work / communication Thread poster: Ivona Nováková
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Ivona Nováková 
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
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Hi all,
I have a question - if anyone had the similar experience (sorry for long story):
I did a job for a really huge and known company. I was paid for QA by hours (not really well, but every money is needed for me now). They asked me how much time I´ve spent on it. I didn´t count the training (it was my the first job for them) but they had problems with the program from the client side, so there were a lot of communication and time spent on the program by testing it... See more Hi all,
I have a question - if anyone had the similar experience (sorry for long story):
I did a job for a really huge and known company. I was paid for QA by hours (not really well, but every money is needed for me now). They asked me how much time I´ve spent on it. I didn´t count the training (it was my the first job for them) but they had problems with the program from the client side, so there were a lot of communication and time spent on the program by testing it over and over again. I told this to them and counted 2.5 hours together (and I think I could ask for more). They answered me, that they understood the complications but they count the work according their standards (about which they had not told me before!!!) so decided to pay me 1.5 hours. Just like that. Why do they even ask if they calculate it by their "standards"? And as I said - it is a huge company with a lot of money that doesn´t really pay well, but these days I don´t have many offers.
If you had the same or similar experience, what did you do?
Thanks in advance,
Ivona ▲ Collapse
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 04:19
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Ivona Nováková wrote:
.... it is a huge company with a lot of money
Now you know why!
If I were you I would just sort this thing out quickly and then never work with those people again.
| | | | | One more try | Oct 27, 2021 |
I would insist on payment because that's the kind of person I am.
But if you're not established with them, they probably won't use you again if you come across as a troublemaker.
So maybe politely try one more time and then let it go. The money for a couple of hours is not much in the greater scheme of things.
| | | | Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | I know... but | Oct 27, 2021 |
the market is not well now and every cent is really needed.
Do you think that this big company will even try to resolve with me this problem and paid me what I want? I am not sure they will so then I will have neither money nor possible further cooperation. I don´t know how these big companies think and cooperate with vendors.
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Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
..But if you're not established with them, they probably won't use you again if you come across as a troublemaker.
So maybe politely try one more time and then let it go. The money for a couple of hours is not much in the greater scheme of things.
I was thinking about this aswell..
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 05:19
French to English
Ivona Nováková wrote:
Why do they even ask if they calculate it by their "standards"?
Ivona
They were hoping you'd ask for even less.
But seriously, was this in writing before you did the job? If all you'd agreed on was the rate and not the number of hours, you're the one who states how long it took you.
Although if it's only a matter of a couple of hours, I'd not bother, and consider the money I lost as an investment in gaining experience working with clients. Then, going forward, only ever start jobs if the client is willing to pay for your very generous estimate. Last week I had a proofreading job: I estimated 13 hours based on the number of words. In the end I only spent 11 hours on the job, because the second half was considerably better than the first, so that was a pleasant surprise for my client.
And a couple of times things have turned out even worse and I've spent longer than what I'd estimated. Both PMs (working at the same agency) agreed to pay me more to account for it. For the first, the last part of the text wasn't even translated: there were sentences in English but they clearly didn't correspond in any way to the source file, so the PM then told their client the last page had to be translated from scratch. For the second job, I wasn't even asking for more money, thinking that it was my fault for underestimating, but the PM said he would make it up by increasing my rate on the next job, and he did. This is what a decent agency does.
| | | | Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
If all you'd agreed on was the rate and not the number of hours, you're the one who states how long it took you.
Exactly. That really surprised me. How could they predicted how much time I spent on it?
I agree that this is probably an investment in gaining experience. Let's see the glass half full.
Thank you all very much for your opiniones. It really helps and you don't even know how much I appreciate it.
| | | | Tina Vonhof (X)
Canada
Local time: 21:19
Dutch to English
+ ...
Ivona Nováková wrote: If all you'd agreed on was the rate and not the number of hours, you're the one who states how long it took you. Exactly. That really surprised me. How could they predicted how much time I spent on it? I agree that this is probably an investment in gaining experience. Let's see the glass half full. Thank you all very much for your opiniones. It really helps and you don't even know how much I appreciate it.
And, Ivona, just because you need the money, that doesn't mean letting people take advantage of you.
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Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
And, Ivona, just because you need the money, that doesn't mean letting people take advantage of you.
It is hard and I was a bit (very) sad about it, but you are absolutely right. What is just one unpaid hour now could be 10 more later.
Thank you for your viewpoint.
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 05:19
French to English
Ivona Nováková wrote:
How could they predicted how much time I spent on it?
When I worked in-house at an agency, the standard was 1hr per 1,000 words, and we'd round it up a bit just in case. Proofreading my best translators, I'd get double that done, but if I didn't know the translator, I'd be checking and double-checking and it would be closer to the standard even without changing very much at all.
| | | | AnnaSCHTR
United States
Local time: 22:19
English to Czech
+ ...
| Nothing much you can do | Oct 27, 2021 |
I know the times are tough, and that being treated in this unfair way is somewhat disappointing and hurtful. Trust me, I know. Realistically speaking:
When working with "smaller" languages, it makes sense to work with large international companies that handle multi-lingual projects. It means dealing with their corporate nonsense, communication problems and the fact that you mean nothing for them other than a little unimportant device that performs certain task.
On the ... See more I know the times are tough, and that being treated in this unfair way is somewhat disappointing and hurtful. Trust me, I know. Realistically speaking:
When working with "smaller" languages, it makes sense to work with large international companies that handle multi-lingual projects. It means dealing with their corporate nonsense, communication problems and the fact that you mean nothing for them other than a little unimportant device that performs certain task.
On the plus side, it might mean a lot of projects for a decent rate (if you insist on it) where those projects kind of balance themselves out, on the long run - some take longer, some take much less effort. You need to look at months of work to see if it is beneficial for you.
I cannot stress enough that you need to insist on good rates. Once they enter in in their database (the real rates for which you are willing to take a project), that's pretty much it. No matter how tough the times are, do not sell yourself short. The time of your life you sell too cheaply - no one is ever going to give it back to you.
This is indeed a learning experience for this particular client, and it might be wise next time to estimate the number of hours in advance and ask them to confirm this. I usually insist on having the advanced confirmation whenever possible. But take a long-term perspective before you burn any bridges. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Abba Storgen (X)
United States
Local time: 22:19
Greek to English
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Ivona Nováková wrote:
according their standards
Here's the standard: Get the translators to agree at the lowest price possible.
Conclusion:
a) If you are new to this agency, ask yourself "why didn't they give this to their more experienced translators?" (that's a trap).
b) If you have a longer history with the agency, accept the lower payment to keep your relationship.
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Abba Storgen (X)
United States
Local time: 22:19
Greek to English
+ ...
| How they think? | Oct 27, 2021 |
Ivona Nováková wrote:
I don´t know how these big companies think and cooperate with vendors.
Given the passive acceptance of 90% or more of translators (a very agreeable crowd), and the massive profit margin of LSPs, they think they are like the government.
Wouldn't you feel like invincible Superman if you could quickly find cheap and agreeable remote workers (and zero obligations from your side), and your profit margin was 80-200%, with the click of a button? Just think about it.
| | | | Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
Given the passive acceptance of 90% or more of translators (a very agreeable crowd), and the massive profit margin of LSPs, they think they are like the government.
Wouldn't you feel like invincible Superman if you could quickly find cheap and agreeable remote workers (and zero obligations from your side), and your profit margin was 80-200%, with the click of a button? Just think about it.
Wow, I´ve never looked at it this way. That explains a lot. Thank you for opening my eyes.
| | | | Ivona Nováková
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:19
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
AnnaSCHTR wrote:
This is indeed a learning experience for this particular client, and it might be wise next time to estimate the number of hours in advance and ask them to confirm this. I usually insist on having the advanced confirmation whenever possible. But take a long-term perspective before you burn any bridges.
Thank you. That is what I am about to start doing from now on - estimate and agree on the number of hours in advance.
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