trazo la frontera de la juventud

English translation: I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

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Spanish term or phrase:	trazo la frontera de la juventud
English translation:	I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation
Entered by:	Barbara Cochran, MFA

10:37 Jul 22, 2022

Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - Poetry & Literature / Poetry

Spanish term or phrase: trazo la frontera de la juventud

Looking for help with this sentence about Spain's poetry sector, in particular, where the author talks about trazando "la frontera de la juventud."

Voy a elegir el año 1980 como fecha de partida, porque esa fue la fecha en la que publiqué mi primer libro. Así que también de manera arbitraria trazo la frontera de la juventud en el grupo de poetas que no habían nacido cuando yo empecé a publicar.

He goes on to make a list of important poets.

Thanks for your help!

Poughkeepsie KudoZ activity Questions: 619 (3 open) (1 without valid answers) (13 closed without grading) Answers: 0 Spain
Local time: 17:46

I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

Explanation:
How I interpret it. I don't think it is s good idea, in this case, to translate the phrase all that literally.

Selected response from:

Barbara Cochran, MFA
United States
Local time: 11:46

Grading comment

Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

3 +4

I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

Barbara Cochran, MFA

I am laying down a marker amongst the younger generation

Andrew Bramhall

(what I did was) to plot the boundaries of youthful endeavo(u)r

Adrian MM.

I set an age limit

Cecilia Gowar

drawing a line that defines the younger generation

Marie Wilson

Discussion entries: 5

Stephanie Ament

United States

@Andrew

13:39 Sep 9, 2022

Hi Andrew. Thanks for your comment. Without seeing the context immediately preceding this sentence, I think it's perfectly reasonable to confirm that the first person singular is indeed what the author intended. The preposition "en" does, of course, mean "among" or "belonging to" in either case (it seems you read that I suggested otherwise in my post). And yes, the notion that the author considers himself to belong to a younger generation of poets should not be taken literally but could be easily understood in a figurative sense.

Andrew Bramhall

United Kingdom

@Stephanie Ament

11:12 Aug 11, 2022

It is indeed " trazo" (I draw/outline) and not " trazÓ); the preposition 'en' here means 'among', and the idea that the AUTHOR HIMSELF considers he belongs to a group of poets who had not yet been born is UTTERLY ILLOGICAL AND LUDICROUS.How can anyone consider themselves to belong to a group of poets who had not yet been born when THEY THEMSELVES PERSONALLY started publishing? Utterly confused logic on your and Toni's part there, I'm afraid, just as with Toni's " hunch" that " trazo" carries an accent, to convert it from 1st person singular present tense to 3rd person singular preterite. What a joke!

Stephanie Ament

United States

11:13 Jul 23, 2022

It's interesting wording. Assuming that it is indeed "trazo" (no accent), as Toni points out, the preposition "en" denotes that the author (somewhat arbitrarily) considers him/herself to belong to a group of poets that hadn't even been born yet when he/she started publishing. So the author traces the edge / walks the line between his/her generation and a younger one.

Toni Castano

Spain

"Trazo" or "trazó"?

15:19 Jul 22, 2022

@Poughkeepsie. Could you please confirm that the verb form you quote ("trazo", no written accent) is the correct one in your text?

José Patrício

Portugal

12:00 Jul 22, 2022

I trace the frontier of the youth:
Mi interpretación:
Con la publicación de su libro en 1980 traza la frontera de los jóvenes comenzaran a publicar libros. O sea, en ese año

Answers

1 hr confidence:

I set an age limit

Explanation:
At the same time I set an arbitrary age limit for the group poets who were not yet born when I started publishing.

I understand he is going to refer to the group of poets born after a certain date, therefore restricting himself to poets of a certain age, and that age limit is arbitrary.

Cecilia Gowar
United Kingdom
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

Spanish
PRO pts in category: 227

1 hr confidence:

drawing a line that defines the younger generation

Explanation:
An option. He says he first published in 1980, so he's referring to those born after this year, I presume.

Marie Wilson
Spain
Local time: 17:46
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 88

3 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

Explanation:
How I interpret it. I don't think it is s good idea, in this case, to translate the phrase all that literally.

Barbara Cochran, MFA
United States
Local time: 11:46
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 103

Grading comment

Selected automatically based on peer agreement.

1 day 20 hrs confidence:

(yo) trazó la frontera de la juventud (what I did was) to plot the boundaries of youthful endeavo(u)r

Explanation:
Así que (more of a Lat. Am. construction cf. ainsi que) también de manera arbitraria > Thus it was that, arbitrarily at that, I plotted vs. skirted or pushed the boundaries of (my own) youth.

I tend to share Toni C's hunch that there is an accent on trazó

Otherwise, the author's (obscure) simile or metaphor ought to be left literally for the reader to interpret.

Example sentence(s):

boundaries were fuzzy at all ages, they became reliably less fuzzy with age.

Reference: http://ludwig.guru/s/skirt+the+boundaries

Adrian MM.
Austria
Native speaker of:

English

18 days confidence:

I am laying down a marker amongst the younger generation

Explanation:
"Voy a elegir el año 1980 como fecha de partida, porque esa fue la fecha en la que publiqué mi primer libro. Así que también de manera arbitraria trazo la frontera de la juventud en el grupo de poetas que no habían nacido cuando yo empecé a publicar."

"I am going to select the year 1980 as my starting date, as that was the year I published my first book. Hence by the same token,(equally/similarly) I am using that very same year as a marker for the younger generation of poets who had not yet been born when I first published"
It can only be " trazO" ,1st person singular present tense.Impossible it could be " trazó"; the clue lies in the very first word "VOY a elegir" "I am going to..", and there is no switch from the first person narrative to a third person narrative anywhere. What is at play here is a literary device common in the Romance languages I'm acquainted with whereby you use the simple present tense to describe an action which in English would be the present or past continuous tense.
"Yo trazÓ", Mr Melmann, really?? It would have to be" yo traCÉ", in the 1st person singular preterite tense. "cf. ainsi que "??? Why, that means "as well as" (tan bien como in Castilian),( and FYI "anziché" in Italian doesn't mean the same as 'ainsi que', it means ' instead of', 'in place of'.)'Así que' = 'hence', or as you say, 'so it is/was that', but that said, it is universal in Spanish and does NOT represent any particular variant. It is a metaphor ( a simile has to be introduced by 'as' or 'like' in English), and what the writer is doing here is a bit of whimsical musing and grandstanding, in a friendly and avuncular manner, with the subliminal message to the younger generation of poets that "this is what I had achieved well before your age, and on the timescales mentioned, (this generation are at least approaching 40, if not 45 as it does not specifically refer to those people born exactly in the year 1980) so I am laying down a marker/ yardstick/benchmark based on age but this is what you should be aspiring to achieve".

Andrew Bramhall
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:46
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 70

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trazo la frontera de la juventud

English translation: I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

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trazo la frontera de la juventud

English translation: I make a somewhat arbitrary distinction between my poetic works and those of the younger generation

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