This question was closed without grading. Reason: Other
Jan 12, 2017 19:57
7 yrs ago
1 viewer *
English term
of its own
English to French
Law/Patents
Law (general)
Dispute
"[the Tribunal] can safely rest, so far as the burden of proof is concerned, on the widely accepted international
principle that a party in litigation bears the burden of proving the facts relied on to support its claim or defence […].
A claimant before an international tribunal must establish the facts on which it bases its case or else it will lose
the arbitration.
The respondent does not in that sense bear any ‘burden of proof’ of its own"
Sa propre charge de la preuve???
principle that a party in litigation bears the burden of proving the facts relied on to support its claim or defence […].
A claimant before an international tribunal must establish the facts on which it bases its case or else it will lose
the arbitration.
The respondent does not in that sense bear any ‘burden of proof’ of its own"
Sa propre charge de la preuve???
Proposed translations
(French)
Proposed translations
-2
28 mins
au défendeur même n´incombe acune charge de preuve
une autre option
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
Nathalie Stewart
: "acune" ? syntaxe ? Ce n'est pas du français... Désolée.
3 mins
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What is it you really find fault with ? the ridiculous typo ou que j´ai omis "lui "même ? ?
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disagree |
Daryo
: typo aside, the way you worded it, the respondent can twiddle his thumbs or just say whatever he wants as he doesn't have to prove anything of whatever he says in his defence!
2 hrs
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-2
2 hrs
English term (edited):
The respondent does not in that sense bear any ‘burden of proof’ of its own
En ce sens, la défenderesse n'est pas en elle-même soumise à aucune 'charge de la preuve'
..
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Note added at 3 hrs (2017-01-12 23:02:20 GMT)
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IOW, as long as the claimant hasn't got any solid proofs for his claims, the respondent can simply say nothing
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Note added at 3 hrs (2017-01-12 23:02:20 GMT)
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IOW, as long as the claimant hasn't got any solid proofs for his claims, the respondent can simply say nothing
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
Jennifer Levey
: The ST refers to the proof of claims made by the claimant/plaintiff. The defendant is not required to "disprove" the claimant's claims, simply because that would often require proof of the inexistance of something, which is legally/logically impossible.
24 mins
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reread the ST carefully ...
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disagree |
GILLES MEUNIER
: c'est incorrect en français, vous avez une double négation : n'est pas - à aucune
6 hrs
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N'importe quoi The kind of "rules" as important as the one about split infinitives - the Earth stood still ...
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+1
3 hrs
En ce sens, il n'imcombe au défendeur aucune charge de preuve qui lui soit propre
my take
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Note added at 8 hrs (2017-01-13 03:57:54 GMT)
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Erratum: CHARGE DE LA PREUVE instead of charge de preuve
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Note added at 8 hrs (2017-01-13 03:57:54 GMT)
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Erratum: CHARGE DE LA PREUVE instead of charge de preuve
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Daryo
: ça marche aussi, mais "... charge de la preuve ..."
7 mins
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Thanks for the remark!
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agree |
Andrée Goreux
2 hrs
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THanks!
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disagree |
Odile Raymond
: "Charge de la preuve" n'est pas dénombrable : on ne peut pas dire "aucune charge de la preuve". Et la "charge de la preuve" n'est pas "propre" (= particulière) à quelqu'un. Elle incombe à quelqu'un.
1 day 13 hrs
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+1
17 hrs
A ce titre, le défendeur n'a pas la charge de prouver quoi que ce soit.
Ou : A ce titre, le défendeur n'a rien à prouver.
Discussion
No, IT'S NOT.
The defendant does not have to prove in a general way that what he's done was right [="on its own"] while the plaintiff has to prove its claims that what the defendant has done was wrong.
BUT the defendant STILL has to prove whatever he wants to use in its defence and any counterclaims, and ONLY that!
you get rid of the "on its own" bit and you turn the sentence into nonsense "The respondent does not bear any ‘burden of proof" - that's simply not happening in the real world! In my rule-book, reality check always wins over "nice style" ...
As to how to translate "on its own", it depends on how you rearrange the whole sentence.
L'emploi des guillemets met l'accent sur ce "fardeau de la preuve" qui constitue une notion bien établie. Pour cette raison, je ne remplacerais l'expression par "charge probatoire" (qui s'éloigne du contexte) et d'autant que si le demandeur établit effectivement sa preuve, l'intimé aura effectivement une "charge probatoire" (il lui faudra bien démontrer de quelque façon que ce qu'avance le demandeur est faux ou inapplicable).
En ce sens, le défendeur n'a pour sa part aucune charge probatoire à assumer.
(Je pense qu' "en soi" serait plutôt "as such")