https://www.proz.com/kudoz/german-to-english/physics/6688918-schall-als-ton-klang-ger%C3%A4usch-oder-l%C3%A4rm.html
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Glossary entry

Deutsch term or phrase:

Schall als Ton, Klang, Geräusch oder Lärm

Englisch translation:

harmonic tones, simple sounds or disturbing noise.

Added to glossary by Ramey Rieger (X)
Jul 21, 2019 23:12
4 yrs ago
4 viewers *
Deutsch term

Schall als Ton, Klang, Geräusch oder Lärm

Deutsch > Englisch Naturwissenschaften Physik Acoustics
"Ob wir nun den Schall als Ton, Klang, Geräusch oder Lärm interpretieren, hängt von der Wellenform des Schalls ab."

This is a text dealing with the more scientific side of how singing bowls from Tibet affect the human body, and how people process sound in general (Wahrnehmung und Verarbeitung mit Klangschalen). Right now, I have it as:

"Whether we interpret sound as a tone, sound, noise, or clamor depends on...." but I don't like it...

I understand the difference between what is being discussed but I'm having difficulty researching the correct equivalents in English since these terms are so similar (Schall and Klang in particular). There are a lot more examples of this but just hearing opinions on this one sentence would enable me to deal with the other instances in the text. Here are a couple more sentences that might help:

"Ist das Verhältnis zwischen Grundschwingung und Oberschwingungen hingegen chaotisch, sprechen wir von einem Geräusch (=weißes Rauschen)."

"Das Produkt un- geordneter Klangwellen, deren Frequenzen und Lautstärke keine Beziehung zuein- ander aufweisen, bezeichnet man als Lärm."
Proposed translations (Englisch)
3 +1 harmonic tones, simple sounds or disturbing noise.
4 +1 vibrations as sound or noise
5 Sound as tone(note), complex (tonal) sound, noise or noise pollution
4 sound as a (musical) note or a (discordant) noise or something in between
3 sound as tone, sound, clang or clamor
3 tones, overlapping tones, sound, or noise
Change log

Jul 24, 2019 06:22: Ramey Rieger (X) Created KOG entry

Discussion

Ramey Rieger (X) Jul 23, 2019:
@Getschi Yes, exactly what I think, too, as I suggested.
Getschi Jul 23, 2019:
Couldn't you use adjectives instead? The words clearly do not exist as nouns in English:
Whether sounds are perceived as neutral, pleasant, disturbing or just plain noisy, depends on the waveform of the sound.
Ramey Rieger (X) Jul 22, 2019:
Qualifiers We're talking about interpretations. There are people who actually enjoy the sound of a chainsaw.
David Hollywood Jul 22, 2019:
as you're new to this site just to say that your question requires a plethora of explanations and normally not permitted but I will try to give you my ideas on this ....
Gabrielle Mazzullo (asker) Jul 21, 2019:
Just an addition for context - this part of the text is talking about the relationship between overtones and the fundamental tone.

Also not relevant, but they're actually from Nepal, not Tibet...typed the wrong place.

Proposed translations

+1
7 Stunden
Selected

harmonic tones, simple sounds or disturbing noise.

I believe qualifiers would better distinguish the one sound from the other.
Example sentence:

The wavelength of acoustic vibrations determines how we interpret them, as harmonic tones, simple sounds or disturbing noise.

Peer comment(s):
agree Björn Vrooman : Qualifiers are good. I agree with Phil's comments but not his approach. English is a rich and colorful language; oversimplification makes it seem like there are only 50 words in the dictionary and 20 of them are prepositions.
1 Tag 3 Stunden
HAHAHA! The sky's the limit.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "I was thinking along these lines and will use descriptive adjectives instead of individual terms. Thank you for your input!"
2 Stunden

sound as tone, sound, clang or clamor

in a progression

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Note added at 2 hrs (2019-07-22 01:32:54 GMT)
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"clang" is OK as in the sound of a bell

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Note added at 2 hrs (2019-07-22 01:33:59 GMT)
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I think the progression would work
Peer comment(s):
neutral philgoddard : You can't say "sound as sound" in my opinion, and "clang" is quite wrong.
3 Stunden
neutral D. I. Verrelli : "sound as sound" is a problem. But I don't mind "clang" for a (standing) bell. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/clang#Noun "clamor"/"clamour" is a bit odd for a noise not made by people speaking/shouting noisily.
2 Tage 12 Stunden
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4 Stunden

tones, overlapping tones, sound, or noise

This is a tough one...

"Whether we interpret sound vibrations as tones, overlapping tones, sound, or noise depends on the waveform of the sound."

Bei dem Ton handelt es sich um gleichmäßige, einheitliche Schwingungen, beim Klang erklingen mehrere Töne gleichzeitig und überlagern sich, Geräusche sind ein wechselhaftes, uneinheitliches Gemisch von Schwingungen und ein Knall ist eine kurze, starke Schwingung
https://www.waldorf-ideen-pool.de/Schule/faecher/physik/klas...
Peer comment(s):
neutral philgoddard : Same comment as above, and you can't say "tones or overlapping tones". That's like saying "cats or black cats".
2 Stunden
Not sure about "sound" but "single tone or overlapping tones" could be an easy fix for your other objection. But the real issue is whether or not any of these terms are appropriate here in the first place. Still doesn't sound particularly satisfying to me
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+1
5 Stunden

vibrations as sound or noise

English doesn't have exact equivalents for all these words, and I think you have to simplify your translation. My version is not perfect (noise is sound, and sound is noise), but I think they're making a distinction between organised, pleasant vibrations, such as the human voice, and random, less desirable ones, such as a chainsaw.
Peer comment(s):
agree Kim Metzger
18 Stunden
neutral D. I. Verrelli : I think this loses the sense of pleasant sounds being a possible 'interpretation' in the original — as indeed you allude to in your explanation.
2 Tage 9 Stunden
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20 Stunden

Sound as tone(note), complex (tonal) sound, noise or noise pollution

Schall als Ton, Klang, Geräusch oder Lärm

Sound as tone/note, complex sound/complex tonal sound, noise or noise pollution

sound [PHYS.] der Schall Pl.: die Schalle/die Schälle [Akustik]
https://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/Schall

Schall (von Althochdeutsch: scal) bezeichnet allgemein mechanische Schwingungen in einem elastischen Medium (Gas, Flüssigkeit, Festkörper).[1] Diese Schwingungen pflanzen sich in Form von Schallwellen fort. In Luft sind Schallwellen Druck- und Dichteschwankungen.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schall
In physics, sound is a vibration that typically propagates as an audible wave of pressure, through a transmission medium such as a gas, liquid or solid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound

sound der Ton Pl.: die Töne
tone der Ton Pl.: die Töne
note [MUS.] der Ton Pl.: die Töne
https://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/Ton

Ton bezeichnet in der Musik ein Schallereignis (sowie dessen Höreindruck und gedankliche Abstraktion), das von Musikinstrumenten, der menschlichen Stimme oder anderweitig erzeugt wird und dem eine mehr oder weniger exakte Tonhöhe zugeordnet werden kann.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton_(Musik)
A musical tone is characterized by its duration, pitch, intensity (or loudness), and timbre (or quality).[1] The notes used in music can be more complex than musical tones, as they may include aperiodic aspects, such as attack transients, vibrato, and envelope modulation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musical_tone

complex tone [TECH.] der Klang Pl.: die Klänge [Akustik]
complex tonal sound [TECH.] der Klang Pl.: die Klänge [Akustik]
https://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/Klang

Mit Klang (von mittelhochdt.: klanc) werden bestimmte Schallereignisse bezeichnet. Insbesondere die physikalische Akustik und die Musik verwenden dabei unterschiedliche Definitionen. Was in der Akustik als Klang bezeichnet wird, entspricht ungefähr dem musikalischen Begriff Ton. Im allgemeinen Sprachgebrauch bezeichnet „Klang“ außerdem das Phänomen unterschiedlicher Charakteristika eines Schallereignisses, z. B. beim „Klang einer Stimme“.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klang

Geräusch (von Rauschen) ist ein Sammelbegriff für alle Hörempfindungen, die nicht als Ton, Klang, Tongemisch, Zusammenklang oder Klanggemisch bezeichnet werden können. Ursache für ein Geräusch sind Schwingungsvorgänge, die in der Regel nicht periodisch verlaufen und sich in ihrer Struktur zeitlich ändern können.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geräusch
Noise is unwanted sound judged to be unpleasant, loud or disruptive to hearing. From a physics standpoint, noise is indistinguishable from sound, as both are vibrations through a medium, such as air or water. The difference arises when the brain receives and perceives a sound.[1][2]
Acoustic noise is any sound in the acoustic domain, either deliberate (e.g., music or speech) or unintended. In contrast, noise in electronics may not be audible to the human ear and may require instruments for detection
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noise

noise der Lärm kein Pl.
https://dict.leo.org/englisch-deutsch/Lärm

Als Lärm oder auch Krach werden Geräusche (Schall) bezeichnet, die durch ihre Struktur (meist Lautstärke) auf die Umwelt (insbesondere Menschen) störend (Störschall), belastend oder gesundheitsschädigend wirken.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lärm
Noise pollution, also known as environmental noise or sound pollution, is the propagation of noise with harmful impact on the activity of human or animal life.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noise_pollution
Note from asker:
I should have mentioned that the target audience is seminar participants learning about this topic, so I think making it very technical is not quite the approach the author was going for. Your answer was helpful though, thank you!
Peer comment(s):
neutral D. I. Verrelli : Understandable approach, given the original indication, "This is a text dealing with the more scientific side [...]."
14 Tage
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2 Tage 15 Stunden

sound as a (musical) note or a (discordant) noise or something in between

Just for the record, a slightly looser translation that gets away from the attempt to literally translate each of the four nouns in the list, while still getting across the idea of a spectrum/continuum/progression.

"Whether we interpret the sound/vibration as a (musical) note/(pleasant) tone or a (discordant) noise or something in between [...]"

Even more loosely:
"Where we interpret the sound/vibration as falling on a/the spectrum/continuum from musical notes/tones to (white/discordant) noise [...]"

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Note added at 3 days 2 hrs (2019-07-25 01:21:20 GMT) Post-grading
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Also "jarring" or "dissonant" noise.
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