Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Spanish term or phrase:
pluma a comer y cenar
English translation:
\"quills\" [large bird] for lunch and dinner / untranslatable play on words!!
Added to glossary by
Lydia De Jorge
Jul 1, 2019 23:42
4 yrs ago
2 viewers *
Spanish term
pluma a comer y cenar
Spanish to English
Art/Literary
Poetry & Literature
poesía barroca española - JÁCARA NUEVA DE LA ZANGARILLEJA
Another from the same jácara. Thank you for your input!
De las cinco reglas,
solo la zangarilleja
aprendió a multiplicar,
¡zarandillo y andar!
Aunque pudo por discreta
la zangarilleja
en las cuatro consumar,
¡zarandillo y andar!
A escribir, si por tener
la zangarilleja
**pluma a comer y cenar,**
¡zarandillo y andar!
De las cinco reglas,
solo la zangarilleja
aprendió a multiplicar,
¡zarandillo y andar!
Aunque pudo por discreta
la zangarilleja
en las cuatro consumar,
¡zarandillo y andar!
A escribir, si por tener
la zangarilleja
**pluma a comer y cenar,**
¡zarandillo y andar!
Proposed translations
(English)
3 | "plume/pen" [pork's boneless flank] for lunch and dinner / untranslatable play on words!! | JohnMcDove |
Proposed translations
2 hrs
Selected
"plume/pen" [pork's boneless flank] for lunch and dinner / untranslatable play on words!!
pluma
Primary meaning,
(All definitions from DRAE)
12. f. Pieza del cerdo posterior a la presa.
Plays with these other meanings,
3. f. pluma de ave que, cortada convenientemente en la extremidad del cañón, servía para escribir.
8. f. Estilo o manera de escribir. Escribe con pluma mordaz.
9. f. Profesión o ejercicio de la escritura. María vive de la pluma.
Presa:
12. f. Pieza del cerdo en forma de abanico situada por encima de la paleta.
https://www.elespanol.com/cocinillas/recetas/carne/20190305/...
http://www.expansion.com/fueradeserie/gastro/2017/02/13/5894...
In so many words, looks like he is saying that she was illiterate, as the only "pluma" (pen) she would have, would be the pork she would eat for lunch and dinner.
The other nuance is that by eating pork, that indicated she had no Jewish blood.
Good luck on rendering this into English!
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Note added at 3 hrs (2019-07-02 03:19:07 GMT)
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You're welcome, Lydia!
I understand your feelings!
Hey, maybe there is some good play on words you could find with "eating a pen for lunch and dinner..." Mmm... Ufff! This is a challenge and a half, to say the least. Maybe some archaic word similar to pen?
With some poetic license, you might find something with a feather... ?
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Note added at 20 hrs (2019-07-02 20:08:18 GMT)
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Hey, what about using "quills"?
That is,
3 quills
another term for penne
‘a dish of pasta quills tossed in a spicy tomato sauce’
https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/quill
Or maybe something with "penne" for lunch and dinner?
https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/penne
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Note added at 6 days (2019-07-08 16:04:57 GMT) Post-grading
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You're welcome!
Thanks to Carol and Charles for their aVe-some input!!! ;-)
Primary meaning,
(All definitions from DRAE)
12. f. Pieza del cerdo posterior a la presa.
Plays with these other meanings,
3. f. pluma de ave que, cortada convenientemente en la extremidad del cañón, servía para escribir.
8. f. Estilo o manera de escribir. Escribe con pluma mordaz.
9. f. Profesión o ejercicio de la escritura. María vive de la pluma.
Presa:
12. f. Pieza del cerdo en forma de abanico situada por encima de la paleta.
https://www.elespanol.com/cocinillas/recetas/carne/20190305/...
http://www.expansion.com/fueradeserie/gastro/2017/02/13/5894...
In so many words, looks like he is saying that she was illiterate, as the only "pluma" (pen) she would have, would be the pork she would eat for lunch and dinner.
The other nuance is that by eating pork, that indicated she had no Jewish blood.
Good luck on rendering this into English!
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2019-07-02 03:19:07 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
You're welcome, Lydia!
I understand your feelings!
Hey, maybe there is some good play on words you could find with "eating a pen for lunch and dinner..." Mmm... Ufff! This is a challenge and a half, to say the least. Maybe some archaic word similar to pen?
With some poetic license, you might find something with a feather... ?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 hrs (2019-07-02 20:08:18 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Hey, what about using "quills"?
That is,
3 quills
another term for penne
‘a dish of pasta quills tossed in a spicy tomato sauce’
https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/quill
Or maybe something with "penne" for lunch and dinner?
https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/penne
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 days (2019-07-08 16:04:57 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------
You're welcome!
Thanks to Carol and Charles for their aVe-some input!!! ;-)
Note from asker:
I'm about to eat my pen!. ;-) Thank you, John. Quite helpful. |
I'll have to get creative... perhaps tomorrow with fresh eyes. |
Pen is also the corral where pigs are kept. Maybe I can play with those two words. |
Hi John! I have opted to use 'quills' as in 'plumas de ganso'. Thank you for all your help! |
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you once more! I adapted based on your suggestion."
Reference comments
54 mins
Reference:
Yo no se de cuando es el texto, pero hasta el siglo XVI, las dos lenguas eram lo mismo: https://www.dicio.com.br/emplumar/
plumar - Variação de emplumar. - [Figurado] Pavonearse, envanecerse. engreirse
feather in one's cap: If you describe something that someone has achieved as a feather in their cap, you mean that they can be proud of it or that it might bring them some advantage.- https://www.collinsdictionary.com/pt/dictionary/english/feat...
swank [verb] a slang word for swagger - to behave or talk in a conceited way.
plumear - 2. (Méx) (= ser prostituta) → to be on the game - https://es.thefreedictionary.com/plumear
plumar - Variação de emplumar. - [Figurado] Pavonearse, envanecerse. engreirse
feather in one's cap: If you describe something that someone has achieved as a feather in their cap, you mean that they can be proud of it or that it might bring them some advantage.- https://www.collinsdictionary.com/pt/dictionary/english/feat...
swank [verb] a slang word for swagger - to behave or talk in a conceited way.
plumear - 2. (Méx) (= ser prostituta) → to be on the game - https://es.thefreedictionary.com/plumear
Note from asker:
El problema es que estas definiciones no parecen encajar en este contexto. Por lo menos yo no lo veo. 'A escribir, si por tener pluma a comer y cenar' |
Discussion
The more birds that she ate
the more quills she could get
But enough of this, I have a ✈️ to catch. Have a nice weekend!
she’d dash off a bill;
and thus was she able
to fill up her table
with nothing less pleasant
than pigeon or pheasant
for everyday fare.
The foie gras or jugged hare -
at her behest -
were kept for best,
while to enhance her mood
and wash down all this food,
she’d never eschew
the odd magnum or two
Apologies to all, especially Lydia!
I may have misinterpreted the rules; anywhere, it's there or thereabouts.
They have already been listed on Page 1.
I already had the 5 "reglas" (from the same book that you quote from): https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=omZnAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA8&lpg=...
Hmmh, that doesn't look very feasible, but perhaps worth a try... If the link doesn't work, I'll delete it
According to this, the Rules are (in this order):-
1 Counting (units, tens, hundreds, thousands ...)
2 Adding
3 Subtracting
4 Multiplying
5 Dividing
And, of course, she couldn't have learned to write without first being able to read - at least, when it suited her.
Incidentally, I wasn't implying (above) that she was trying to improve herself in any way other than enriching herself at others' expense (hence being so adept at multiplying - again, when it suited her!
It may be worth adding here that the desire to improve oneself by getting an education is a generic feature of the picaresque, though the desire to be live a genuinely good life is generally frustrated by a combination of bad luck and bad inclinations. For women, in any case, opportunities for actual schooling were virtually non-existent; higher-class women were educated at home.
In the verses we’re considering here, it says she never studied basic arithmetic (the “five rules” are addition, subtraction, multiplication, simple division and long division); all she learned was “multiplication”: how to get rich (in the “school of life”). Not because she was stupid, but just because she never even went to school (she’s from the underclass); she was intelligent (discreta) enough to have learned them all, but didn’t. “Discreto” was a morally ambiguous term, which could imply mental acuity or simply astuteness, ability to see the main chance.
(Anyone interested in finding out about the “cinco reglas” and the various “reglas de tres” can find details here: http://bibliotecadigital.jcyl.es/i18n/consulta/registro.cmd?... )
She did, however, learn to write, because she has “pluma a comer y cenar”.
(contd in next post)
“La Zangarilleja es una variación más [...] del tipo de la mujer desenvuelta y vagabunda, que, salida de las más bajas capas sociales, se dedica a la vida alegre, obteniendo durante algún breve tiempo ventajas materiales, y terminando su existencia triste y oscuramente en un hospital.”
That’s the generic description; here’s the summary of this poem:
“El proceso de vida de la Zangarilleja es el de tantas otras de todos los tiempos: principia de gorrona [prostitute] [...]; se instala luego en casa principal, acompañada de la inevitable Celestina, y en lugar de comer pasteles quiere regalarse con torta real o pichones empanados. Protegida primero por algún escribano [...] acaba en amiga de un duque, con lo cual anda ya en coche y gasta mucho tiempo en sus afeites y peinado. Cuando recibe la visita de algún pariente del pueblo, le despide pronto [...]. Y se casa al fin [...], aunque proponiéndose abandonar del todo su antiguo vivir [...]”
http://www.memoriademadrid.es/download.php?nombre=bhm_revbam...
(cont in next post)
The other line repeated in every verse, “zarandillo y andar”, expresses her mobility. A zarandillo was a small sieve. Autoridades again: “Zarandillo. Por semejanza se llama al que con viveza, y ligereza, anda de una parte à otra: y assi se dice andar como un zarandillo.”
This puts us firmly in the picaresque world. The basic idea is that she’s corrupt, astute, mobile geographically and socially, and that she ends badly. She starts as a prostitute, lives by her wits, by tricking people, and manages to enter a respectable household, to enjoy a comfortable life. She’s good at passing herself off as respectable, but it’s an act. She would like to throw off her past but ultimately can’t.
(cont. in next post)
This could tie in with the fact that for all her pretence of being as dumb as any other girl, she was in fact a past master at the 3 R's when it suited her (she was particularly numerate, especially when it came to multiplication - the fourth of the five "reglas"!).
It's a long poem, and I'm afraid I haven't had the chance to read all of it...
However, whenever she possesses a pen,
she'll write and write to her heart's content
I was looking for the continuation of this verse in a bid to see if it shed any light on the meaning. This is only half of the original (?) verse, but, imo, the rest didn't seem relevant. Sorry I didn't copy and paste it though :( as others might have thought otherwise...
I thought I had read somewhere in passing that there was a purpose to all this scribbling (demanding cash/payments??) but can't for the life of me find it now. The remainder of the verse didn't shed any light in this respect.
The presence or absence of an accent after "comer" is almost certainly insignificant, since a comma before "y", which is nowadays wrong by Academy rules, was quite common in the seventeenth century.
One further thought: I wonder whether "pluma", as well as being a metonym for writing on the primary level, might also be a metonym for birds on a secondary level: that is, she now eats game birds for lunch and dinner, as a way of saying that she is now prosperous. Just an idea; it could well be quite wrong.
A escribir, si, por tener
la Zangarilleja
pluma a comer, y cenar,
çarandillo andar.
"Se llama en estilo familiar y festivo la porcion de aire que se expele con estruendo por la parte posterior. Lat. Ventris strepitus, flatus."
De las cinco reglas,
aprendió a multiplicar,
Aunque pudo por discreta
en las cuatro consumar,
A escribir, si por tener
**pluma a comer y cenar,**