https://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/law-contracts/4747384-subrogado-en-los-derechos.html
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Glossary entry

Spanish term or phrase:

subrogado en los derechos

English translation:

subrogated in the rights

Added to glossary by Adrian MM. (X)
Mar 25, 2012 01:34
12 yrs ago
47 viewers *
Spanish term

subrogado en los derechos

Spanish to English Law/Patents Law: Contract(s)
Here we go again with the same document as my previous questions. i.e. from a document originally drafted in Basque (probably based on Spanish regulations), then translated into Spanish, which I'm now translating into English.

I know what this means but I would have thought it was the other way around. i.e. the new owner would assume the rights and obligations of the previous owner?

El cambio de titularidad del establecimiento o de la empresa operadora no supondrá la extinción de la autorización de instalación vigente, quedando el nuevo titular subrogado en los derechos y obligaciones del anterior, hasta que se cumpla el período de vigencia.

No obstante, el nuevo titular podrá denunciar la validez de la autorización de instalación ante la Dirección de Juego y Espectáculos, en cuyo caso, la subrogación tendrá efectos por un período máximo de tres años, a partir de la fecha de la denuncia.

Thanks!
Proposed translations (English)
4 +4 subrogated in the rights
5 assumes the rights
Change log

Mar 25, 2012 03:15: philgoddard changed "Field (specific)" from "Games / Video Games / Gaming / Casino" to "Law: Contract(s)"

Apr 2, 2012 18:29: Adrian MM. (X) Created KOG entry

Discussion

Richard Hill (asker) Mar 28, 2012:
Yes, thanks Lorena! Just wishing I could get my head around the term, "subrogated in the rights". Not to worry though. Only one hour's proofreading to go :)
lorenab23 Mar 28, 2012:
As I mentioned on my very first entry your translation: the new owner would/shall assume the rights and obligations of the previous owner is dead on...
Richard Hill (asker) Mar 28, 2012:
Here I go again! As I complete the proofreading of this document, and come across this term again, it is just one of those terms I can't get my head around. Sorry to go on, but, again, if subrogate is synonymous with substitute then to say that the 'new owner shall be subrogated/substituted' just doesn't seem right, in that it would make more sense to my mind, if it said, the 'previous owner shall be subrogated'. Anyway, having had so much confirmation, I’m sure you are all right and that it’s just me who is confused by this. I am still tempted to work around it by saying “the new owner shall assume the rights and obligations of the previous owner”
Dan Ilioiu Mar 25, 2012:
In my oppinion, the translation is straight clear. Even if we let aside the logic and presume that the "nuevo titular" can be substituted by the "anterior" - the phrase would have been differently formulated.
Julie Thurston Mar 25, 2012:
could subrogado be more like surrogate, like carrying the previous owners rights and obligations to term.
Richard Hill (asker) Mar 25, 2012:
I don't know whether you're asking me or Lorena but, it must be that "the new owner takes over all the previous owners rights and obligations", but my confusion is with respect to the original, in that "quedando subrogado" suggests, to my mind at least", that it is the "nuevo titular" that is subrogated/substituted rather than the one doing the subrogation/substitution, so to speak
Julie Thurston Mar 25, 2012:
just for my own sanity, you are saying that the new owner takes over all the previous owners rights and obligations, that's what I understood from the spanish.
Richard Hill (asker) Mar 25, 2012:
I see what you mean but "quedando subrogado" suggests, to my mind at least", that it is the "nuevo titular" that is subrogated/substituted rather than the one doing the subrogation/substitution, so to speak. But yeah, I think I get your meaning. Thanks, Lorena!
lorenab23 Mar 25, 2012:
let's make it as wordy in English and maybe you will see how is being phrased in Spanish: the new owner will subsitute the previous owner in his/her rights and obligations until the period of validity expires...
Richard Hill (asker) Mar 25, 2012:
Also: If the verb "subrogar" means to substitute, isn't it the previous owner's rights that are subrogated/substituted and not the rights and obligations of the "nuevo titular"?
Richard Hill (asker) Mar 25, 2012:
Hi Lorena I haven't come across this term before, so is "the new owner is subrogated in the rights and obligations of the previous owner" the same as "the new owner assumes the rights and obligations of the previous owner"?
lorenab23 Mar 25, 2012:
Rich that is exactly what the text is saying and your translation is dead on...

Proposed translations

+4
8 hrs
Selected

subrogated in the rights

... and obligations, so takes over.

It's the right way round. The new proprietor *is* subrogated in the previous one's: quedando el nuevo titular subrogado en los derechos y obligaciones del anterior.

Subrogation is often used in insurance meaning the ins. co. stands in the shoes of the insured and takes over his or her rights and obligations e.g. to conduct litigation on the latter's behalf cf. assignment and novation of debts.

Note the prepositions: subrogation TO a party IN the rights and obligations.
Reference:

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/law_general/1352259-subrogar_en_las_obigaciones_del_titular_frente_a_xxx.html

Peer comment(s):
agree James A. Walsh : "Subrogated TO" I would have thought.
24 mins
You've got many G/hits on your side for the prep. But IMO they are all wrong. NB subrogation TO a person IN his or her rights/concur WITH a person IN his or her opinion.
agree Andy Watkinson
2 hrs
Many thx. You may be on to a winner again.
agree AllegroTrans
4 hrs
Thx. Seems to be a straightforward answer to a straightforward question.
agree Charles Davis : Definitely. I note that the House of Lords uses "subrogated to the rights of" here: http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld199798/ldjudgmt/j... // "in" seems logical. I wondered if it was US/UK. Comment not intended mischievously!
7 hrs
Hum! '...the subject of subrogation is bedeviled by problems of terminology .... Subrogated to a (land) charge... subrogated to rights'. The South African origins of two of the Law Lords in that case doubtless have no bearing on the question.
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "As you can see from the discussion, I had trouble getting my head around this term, but... Thanks, Tom"
5 hrs

assumes the rights

Yes, your understanding is correct. The new owner assumes the rights and obligations of the previous owner.
Reference:

http://buscon.rae.es/draeI/

Note from asker:
Thanks, Carol
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