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Tax and VAT regime for self-employed translators in Greece
Thread poster: Claire Soulié
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Correct Jan 4, 2016

Claire Soulié wrote:

the UK state is working well


I think that was meant to be "the UK state works well"

- and so it does, despite the present government's vicious cuts in funding. By and large, so far as the ordinary punter is concerned, the UK administrative system is run by honest people who are unfailingly polite and punctilious and will make every effort to deal with all queries and solve all problems (although of course when you get into the Big League of tax avoidance and evasion, and billions of pounds are being moved around, different rules apply).

I would still be living happily in Italy.... and enjoying the bread....., had it not been for the fact that 20 years of trying to make an honest living, not take backhanders from anyone, and pay all the taxes, wore me down and made me miserable. I was spending 2 full working days per week just trying to keep myself "in regola" (in compliance with all the legal/administrative requirements).

I have known lots of Greek people and the way they describe it, the situation in Greece is not dissimilar.


 
Philip Lees
Philip Lees  Identity Verified
Greece
Local time: 10:17
Greek to English
Solidarity Jan 4, 2016

Tom in London wrote:

Philip - it's very similar in Italy, where it's common to hear people justifying their own dishonesty by saying "why should I pay all my taxes when I know the politicians are just lining their own pockets?"


Here it is true (and probably Italy, too). A few years ago the government introduced a so-called "solidarity" tax for self-employed people who earn more than a certain (not very large) amount. This is to be paid on top of income tax. When it first came in, I was told by someone that I might be exempt from it, as I live in a small village. No such luck. My accountant told me that exemptions applied only to the disabled, the clergy, some others that I don't now remember, and Members of Parliament. Now many, if not most, Greek MPs also have a private business of some kind. So they took care to exempt themselves from the "solidarity" tax. When I learned that, at that point I shed any last vestiges of belief I had in the fairness of the tax system here.

And let's not even talk about the tax breaks for shipping companies. Most of the wealth of Greece's oligarchs never goes through the tax assessment process at all.


 
Dan Lucas
Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
File under "Don't believe everything you hear" Jan 4, 2016

Philip Lees wrote:
Really? That's not what I hear. Although I'm originally British, if I do decide to leave Greece, the UK is not anywhere near the top of my list of alternatives.

Hearsay, whatever the source, and the experience living in a country day-to-day are very different things.

I lived away from the UK for nearly twenty years and travelled widely during that time. Having returned home three years ago I've been feeling quietly vindicated by how well things work and how pleasant and polite most people still are here in Britain. Also I find it refreshing to live again in a climate where you are neither boiled in the summer nor snow-bound in winter.

Back on topic, more or less, from a business angle there's no place I'd rather be as a small businessman than the UK. The state is very clear about what it wants from you, appears to act swiftly and fairly punitively if you get it wrong, but otherwise mostly keeps out of your way.

As I said above, there's no substitute for living in the country and you're the expert on the Greek situation. Assuming that the Claire has already made the decision to move, what should she do? With regard to the accountancy issue, is there an accountancy association she could contact for a member's directory or something?

Regards
Dan


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2008)
Italian to English
British expats in Greece Jan 4, 2016

THere's lots of discussion about accountants (and other things) on that "British expats in Greece"website I suggested earlier. Some of it makes for depressing reading though....

 
Philip Lees
Philip Lees  Identity Verified
Greece
Local time: 10:17
Greek to English
Abyss Jan 4, 2016

Dan Lucas wrote:

Hearsay, whatever the source, and the experience living in a country day-to-day are very different things.


I was talking about what I'd heard from friends and family based permanently in the UK, as well as following the news on line, mainly through the BBC World Service and the Grauniad.


Assuming that the Claire has already made the decision to move, what should she do? With regard to the accountancy issue, is there an accountancy association she could contact for a member's directory or something?



I think she should take Tom's advice and try to preserve her residence status in the UK for tax purposes. Or somewhere else, anywhere except Greece.

If I saw somebody about to leap off a cliff into a bottomless abyss, I would try to persuade them not to do it. I would not hand them a parachute catalogue.

(NOTE: I am only proposing legal solutions here. There may be other possibilities for those who are not too faint of heart, but as a responsible professional I could never recommend such an option.)


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2008)
Italian to English
I agree Jan 4, 2016

Philip Lees wrote:

I think she should take Tom's advice and try to preserve her residence status in the UK for tax purposes.


Yes - I don't see the point of taking this enormous risk when one could simply go to Greece as a visitor, perhaps for extended periods, but remain in the UK for tax purposes.

[Edited at 2016-01-04 12:27 GMT]


 
Dan Lucas
Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Succinctly put Jan 4, 2016

Philip Lees wrote:
If I saw somebody about to leap off a cliff into a bottomless abyss, I would try to persuade them not to do it. I would not hand them a parachute catalogue.

A splendid analogy!

With regard to your other comment, I suspect playing by "Northern European" rules (abiding by the law, for example) in a "Mediterranean" environment would significantly disadvantage a business...

Regards
Dan


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Indeed Jan 4, 2016

Dan Lucas wrote:

....I suspect playing by "Northern European" rules (abiding by the law, for example) in a "Mediterranean" environment would significantly disadvantage a business...

Regards
Dan


Indeed. When I was practising as an architect in Italy, I found that many clients would try to pay me significantly less than they should, on the assumption that I was taking bribes from all the suppliers and contractors (I wasn't, although the pressure to do so was continuous and my refusal to do so gave me the reputation of being a fool who was difficult to deal with and was making himself look as though he didn't understand "the rules of the game").

But we digress....


 
Claire Soulié
Claire Soulié  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:17
Member (2008)
English to French
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Parachute Jan 4, 2016

Gentlemen

I am very amused at Phil's analogy... I shall do some more research. I know that things are difficult in Greece, but it also costs a lot to pay a rent in London only to store one's personal effects and stay there 6 months per year.

Dan, I agree with you, everything is easier in the UK. People are very efficient and it is also a very friendly and pleasant place to live.

I have really enjoyed my 15 years there and it looks like there is no way o
... See more
Gentlemen

I am very amused at Phil's analogy... I shall do some more research. I know that things are difficult in Greece, but it also costs a lot to pay a rent in London only to store one's personal effects and stay there 6 months per year.

Dan, I agree with you, everything is easier in the UK. People are very efficient and it is also a very friendly and pleasant place to live.

I have really enjoyed my 15 years there and it looks like there is no way out anyways so... we shall see!

Thanks again for all your advice
Claire
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Tax and VAT regime for self-employed translators in Greece







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